Fall Brawl this weekend in Jersey, and im sure teams are playing elsewhere. Use this thread to post any scores if you hear em. If you play individual games against other teams, people would love to hear the results (in addition to posting em on the score reporter of course) as well. So feel free to post em here.
Enjoy
Friday, October 20, 2006
Weekend Open Thread - Fall Brawl Edition
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32 comments:
Hey does anyone know how the first day went?
CB East dropped out due to not having enough players committ... hopefully they got a replacement (though I don't know)
Lower Merion went 2-2, losing in the finals of the JV Division? I think? I have a hard time getting info from people who were barely paying attention to the big picture.
Princeton went 2-1. We beat Watchung 15-9, lost to Pennsbury 15-10 then in our last game beat Beacon 13-9. The last score might be wrong.
The first day ended with everyone holding seed in the Varsity Division. Very windy and cold all day. Some teams seemed to be affected more then others.
If thre are no upsets semi's should look like this:
Pennsbury v. Needham
Columbia v. Princeton
Should be a great afternoon of High School Ultimate. Warm and Calm conditions today will make the games much cleaner.
Columbia beats Princeton in a close game to advance to the finals vs Pennsbury.
Pennsbury beats Needham 15 - 3 in their semi-final.
Pennsbury goes up 4 - 0 on CHS and never looks back winning The Third Fall Brawl 13 - 7, in a very dominating performance.
Princeton beat JP Stevens 13-10 or something like that, lost to Columbia 14-11 or close to that, and lost to Needham 13-9 in an ugly game in which both teams were out of it.
How was the semifinal Columbia-Needham?
what a surprise, Pennsbury wins the tournament, again, and beats Columbia, again. Where is the competition in PHUL besides Pennsbury? I feel bad for the Peyote, this must be getting extremely bored nowadays.
the competition in PHUL would be North Hills, Mount Lebo, Hampton and more.
the competition in PHUEL where peyote play is interesting. last year pennsbury had cb east and wissahickon, before that wissahickon had cheltenham for the two years before that.
before that if im not mistaken were the days of cb east dominance with wissahickon on its heels and vice versa.
my point being, in recent memory, and if i had more information i would contest since the beginning of PHUEL no team has had an easy time getting to the championship. the faces change but there will always be competition and teams that outperform expectations.
there are teams within phuel that have the raw talent to give pennsbury a game the question is if those teams can find the instruction, dedication, leadership and unity to pull off the unexpected.
we'll see i guess.
was the columbia-princeton game as close as the score makes it seem?
who won the b division
I would say the Columbia-Princeton game was definitely as close as the score made it. Princeton got up a break or two in the first half if i remember correctly, but then columbia took half. We traded points for the beginning of the second half, but then like in games past, Columbia's depth wore out Princeton. It was a good hard game and columbia did a great job of finishing.
Cheltenham won the B division, with Pennsbury B - Unit taking 2nd place.
Cheltenham won the JV playing with one sub for the first two games, then savage for the other two games. The last game against Scarsdale was a shutout, 13-0.
Shutting out Scarsdale is not an accomplishment to brag about. Pennsbury B Unit beat them 13 - 1.
According to Mark Rosser's latest e-mail, it looks like there will be a Phall PHUEL tournament at Cheltenham
This may also answer some of the afoorementioned questions, at least. Unfortunately, I doubt anyone in PHUEL this year will give Peyote much of a run -- they themselves are going to be real Easterns contenders, so this is no surprise. The other semifinalists in PHUEL last year, CB East, Wissahickon, and LM, who all beat each other, all graduated very strong senior classes (in the case of LM, their entire A team)...
I think the 2nd spot in PHUEL is very up for grabs, with teams like the Pterodactyls, St. Joe's, Cheltenham, and LM all have shots at it.
No Phul teams will come close to giving Pennsbury a game. None of them could play with them last year, with Pennsbury only graduating 2 players, what makes you think this year will be different?
Your right, there won't be a difference. Peyote is going to have to focus outside of the state this year for any competitive competition. There goal must be beating the consistent powerhouse high school teams, cough cough Amhearst.
Peyote won states in 04, 06, and will in 07 this year. If that doesn't speak of a dynasty Mr McCabe, then I don't know what a dynasty is. You are correct though when you say it hasen't been a cakewalk in recent years to win states, but for the last couple it will be, and for the next couple it will as well.
you could say that it speaks of dynasty, but i would argue that pennsbury at its current state is not a dynasty.
look at other teams we consider dynasties - amherst, has not lost a national championship event in how many years.
columbia has won the state championship for how many years now.
my argument for high school sports at least is that to be considered a dynasty you must maintain a level of play over more than 4 years. tough requirements, and perhaps would weed out many really amazing teams, but i think that level of consistency of dominance over time is what qualifies a dynasty.
i have no disagreement that pennsbury is a very very good team, and it is exciting to have the possibility of someone giving amherst a game this year, but itll take a few more years for them to reach dynasty stature in my book.
im looking forward to it though.
I think what seperates Peyote from a dynasty is that, likely, after this senior class graduates, they will fall back down and not win States in '08. If they surprise me, awesome, but unless they do, they are not a "dynasty" in the same way that Amherst, Paideia and Columbia have strong class after strong class.
That doesn't mean they won't give Amherst a good run this year.
here's a question for y'all. what's more noteworthy, winning the state championship of new jersey or pennsylvania? granted, both states are somewhat weak after its top three or four teams or so. but which title is more prestigious?
at the moment, PA boasts more teams and has thriving leagues in philly and pittsburgh. in new jersey, there's only one state-wide league with little to no adult leadership/support and little annual growth.
i agree that Peyote is not yet a dynasty. if they can't keep it up after the '07 class graduates, then i would put them in the category of one-hit wonders. that's not a dis. that category is impressive, including:
- scarsdale '96 (semi-finals of the amherst invite; the mueller twins)
- sidwell '96 (finals of the amherst invite, beat amherst in pool play)
- brooklyn tech '98 (previously the weaker half in the 90s rivalry with bronx science, came together to nearly dethrone amherst in the inaugral HS Nationals)
- brutal grassburn '99 (peaked to win it all at HS Nationals in Philly)
- newton north '00 (finals of HS Nats also in Philly, beat amherst in the semis)
there may be others, but these teams stand out as not being dynastic, but one-hit wonders. they may have other decent years, but only one time were they really really good.
so, time will tell where pennsbury measures up.
true dynasties: amherst, paideai. the rest are pretenders. state dynasties don't count.
correction: it was scarsdale in the finals of the '96 amherst invitational. scarsdale hasn't made it to the finals of any significant tournament since. sidwell friends must've bowed out in the semis that year.
There is no question Columbia is a top notch ultimate program, but Pennsylvania is one of the biggest states in terms of teams with ultimate squads. PHUL and PHUEL are well established and the league I am in charge of, CPHUL (Central Pennsylvania), looks to grow by about 150% over last season (may be even more than that). Three leagues that feed into a State Championship is pretty impressive, not just in the state but in the country, in terms of organization, number of teams and growth year in and out. Also, we are starting to see programs that produce higher and higher quality teams year after year. In short, I think Pennsylvania's team programs, as a whole, are on the rise and are beginning to produce consistantly competative teams year after year.
Just throwing a dark horse out there, but watch out for State College HS this season out of CPHUL. Their top players consistantly play with Penn State and Hooray (Nationals bound Club Co-ed) players and the team played well against everyone they faced at Div. 2 Club Sectionals. They've also been scrimmaging Penn State's B team. They're the clear favorites to win CPHUL this year (again), but if they can get out of Central PA and play some more teams, it would probably serve them well.
Also, I plan on hosting a fall tournament next year in South-Central Pennsylvania, which I am hoping will be a great location to attract quality teams from various states and leagues. Any thoughts about when and what the tournament should look like?
Although Pennsbury may not be a dynasty yet, they are working hard to establish the program as a force in youth Ultimate. With a thriving B team, the Dactlys, a brand new girls team, and a new coach, Pennsbury is taking steps in securing a solid future for the program for years to come. Even if they do not reach "dynasty status" the growth of the program speaks wonders and is something not seen in PHUEL or PHUL or CPHUL ever.
On the topic of tournaments, Yorktown-HB Woodlawn is most likely(95%) going to be hosting a tournament in mid to late march next year. We are looking to make it a very competitive tournament so keep your calendars open.
We have already contacted some teams about coming but if you haven't heard from us and want to get more info you can email at ivo_nn@yahoo.com.
I'd give the northwest school after the '08 season to reach dynasty. They have been a top team in the west for 2 or 3 years, meeting amherst in the finals of the last nationals in 04 and this year will dominate yet again, and by the end of the '08 season, will reach dynasty level.
What about Hopkins? They have been doing very well against the regional competition for the past 2 or 3 years and have gone to big tournaments like paideia cup and westerns and doing well there. They may not be at the same level, but if some were saying columbia was a dynasty for winning states a million years in a row...
Whatever happened to the pennsbury-columbia writeups?
I believe that Pennsbury is the best team on the East Coast this year, and we are excited to prove it. Our team has improved greatly since last season, graduating one starter, and with Bill Kieffer as the teams first coach, I know we can beat Paideia and Amherst.
Unfortunately we cannot find much competition in the fall (other than Columbia), but we are anxious for the spring when we can play the better teams. Hopefully, our Senior Prom will not prevent our starters from going to Easterns, but we are excited to go back to the Paideia Cup in april.
Noah Saul #24
Pennsbury Ultimate
haha yes why is that not the first time we have been warned?
something must be going on.
The Pennsbury, Columbia debate could possible go on for years to come.
Columbia has won states the past five years (it might be six) Playing against teams like princeton, Watchung Hills, and JP Stevens who also place very high in other non state tournaments. They have taken second at easterns in 2005 and placed in the upper top ten in 2006, although some debate could go into that after losing by one point to pennsbury in the quarters that CHS just did not care about the placement game and played some of their younger players. They placed in the quarter finals of nationals twice in 2000 and in 2001 but had a bit of a drop off after that. They are a very young team, in the upa write up it was mentioned how they had 8 sophomores on the roster last year, and could be solid for at least three more years.
Pennsbury, a team made up of mostly seniors has won their state championships three or four times playing against teams like Wisa(I am not even going to attempt to spell their name) and other solid philly teams. They went to the semi finals of easterns last year to face a very strong Amherst team and while they put up a good fight had no fight left in them after playing a tough match up with CHS first. Being that Easterns was the first time that Pennsbury went to a regional/national tournament other then states it is hard to judge if they are considered to be a dynasty.
This year the two teams met in the finals of both the tournaments that both teams went to. Pennsbury out played CHS in both meetings, and walked away with two easy wins. Right now Pennsbury has the edge over CHS but, lets not forget last year CHS fell to Pennsbury twice in the fall of 05 but came back in the spring ready to go and played some hard games against Pennsbury. With the Pennsbury team graduating most of their players this year, and CHS still being a mostly junior based team that this year could be Pennsbury but next year will be CHS.
Personally I see easterns being a toss up with several teams being in the mix. Amherst will prob win it all again as they always do, but watch out because my guess is second place at easterns will prob not be either CHS or Pennsbury but actually be a rematch of last years easterns finals.
Although Pennsbury is very very Senior heavy this year, we have established a good program with a lot of our younger players (freshman sophomores and juniors) playing at pretty high level. Columbia is always going to be around in mid-may playing their asses off, and next year should be an indicator of whether Pennsbury can establish a dynasty caliber team, but I would not start counting out the under-classman which will represent Pennsbury next year.
"Being that Easterns was the first time that Pennsbury went to a regional/national tournament other then states it is hard to judge if they are considered to be a dynasty."
We went to Paideia Cup and lost to Paideia on Universe point after blowing an 11-8 lead in a game too twelve, and we also went to Amherst and put up 10 against a virtually unstoppable Amherst team. I expect ourselves, Paideia, Amherst and Columbia to be battling it out for the best team on the East Coast.
Isaac Saul #19 (sophomore)
Pennsbury Varsity Ultimate
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